# TWiT 1085: Waiting In Line With Sam - Musk vs. Altman: Behind the Scenes

Podcast: This Week in Tech (Audio)
Published: Jun 17, 2026
Reading time: 26 min
Canonical: https://podbrew.app/briefs/this-week-in-tech-audio-twit-1085-waiting-in-line-with-sam-musk-vs-altman-behind

Leo Laporte, Larry Magid, Marshall Kirkpatrick, and Jacob Ward gather to dissect the complex relationship between technology and society. They examine how major tech players are reshaping how information is disseminated, consumed, and controlled.

The conversation navigates critical issues, from Google's ambitious AI-driven search transformation and the decline of traditional news media to the profound privacy implications of smart glasses and pervasive digital surveillance. They also delve into the ethical conundrums of AI in healthcare, the evolving role of independent creators, and the power struggles among tech's elite.

Understanding these shifts is crucial as technology giants increasingly dictate our access to knowledge, commerce, and even political discourse. The discussion highlights the urgent need to balance innovation with ethical considerations, safeguard human autonomy, and protect privacy in an increasingly algorithm-driven world.

## Key takeaways

- CBS News Radio, despite attracting 22 million weekly listeners and being slightly profitable, was shut down, sparking debate about the role and survival of traditional news media.

- The closure is largely attributed to corporate consolidation, with Paramount's ownership of CBS being a key factor, rather than purely economic reasons.

- Independent online creators are increasingly becoming primary conduits for news, receiving sensitive information directly due to their close audience relationships.

- The potential decline of traditional "primary layer" journalism, which provides original reporting, threatens the very foundation upon which secondary commentary and news consumption by younger audiences depend.

- Meta's new "unoriginal content" policy could inadvertently suppress news dissemination and public understanding by penalizing creators who share and contextualize news footage.

- Algorithmic personalization, though efficient, significantly reduces serendipitous discovery of diverse or unexpected content, leading to information filter bubbles.

- Social media platforms like TikTok, initially offering random content, now create highly specific feeds that can become monotonous, requiring users to actively 'reset' or manipulate algorithms for broader exposure.

- Despite AI's potential for individual empowerment, the industry is rapidly consolidating power among a few dominant companies, raising concerns about concentrated control over this transformative technology.

- Google is integrating its Gemini AI to provide direct answers, graphics, video generation, and embedded shopping within search, shifting away from a traditional link-based model.

- The new 'zero-click search' approach is projected to drastically reduce traffic and monetization opportunities for content publishers, with some estimating up to 89% drops in search visitors.

- Research shows that large language models, when repeatedly asked open-ended questions, tend to narrow their responses over time and converge on similar answers across different models, leading to homogenized information.

- The combined effect of AI answer homogenization and platform-controlled information creates a "narrowing spiral" of human choice, potentially leading to a future where algorithms dictate purchasing and informational decisions.

- The push for AI to deliver immediate answers and handle decisions could diminish critical thinking skills, potentially making traditional education focused on knowledge acquisition less relevant.

- Smart glasses from major tech companies are rapidly advancing, promising integrated experiences like enhanced hearing or visual assistance, but they also introduce profound privacy challenges and the potential for constant surveillance.

- AI models are susceptible to hoaxes and misinformation, as demonstrated by the 'Bixonamania' experiment where a deliberately fabricated disease spread through AI after being published on unvetted preprint servers.

- It is crucial to fact-check AI-generated medical information against trusted sources and always consult a human doctor, as AI can confidently present false information, making human oversight indispensable.

- Creators often feel dishonest when claiming ownership of work significantly aided by AI, leading to a 'dirty little secret' around AI tool usage.

- Human judgment, perspective, and the ability to contextualize information are becoming increasingly valuable in an AI-driven world.

- General Motors was fined for selling sensitive customer data, including driving habits and location, from its OnStar service to data brokers, raising significant privacy concerns.

- New invisible surveillance methods are rapidly developing, including Wi-Fi routers that can identify individuals and lasers that detect unique heartbeats, raising significant privacy concerns due to their potential use without warrants.

## 04:01 - 14:04 The Closure of CBS News Radio Highlights Media Consolidation

CBS News Radio, a historic network known as the "Tiffany Network," ceased operations despite reportedly reaching 22 million listeners weekly. This audience figure surpasses the combined viewership of all major evening news broadcasts. Its shutdown prompted discussion about the relevance of traditional radio in an age where digital alternatives are abundant, though some argue radio remains crucial for specific demographics and regions.

Despite claims of being slightly profitable, the network's closure is attributed by some to corporate consolidation rather than purely financial motives. CBS is owned by Paramount, and the decision to pull the plug is seen as part of a larger trend where corporate ownership influences news content and journalistic independence.

Concerns were raised about the implications of such consolidation for truth-telling and accountability in media. The hosts suggested that telling the truth might be uncomfortable or dangerous for certain powerful entities. The discussion also touched upon an incident where Paramount Plus allegedly forced the removal of a Stephen Colbert segment from public access, illustrating the extensive control corporations can exert over content.

This situation highlights a shift in the media landscape, where journalistic integrity might be compromised by corporate interests and where the ability to hold power accountable becomes increasingly challenging in an adversarial environment.

> Telling the truth can be dangerous if you're basing your administration on lies.

## 14:04 - 20:04 Independent Creators, the Primary News Layer, and Meta's Content Rules

The traditional role of journalism is shifting, with independent creators now often acting as primary news sources. Some creators, initially focused on niche topics like knitting or cooking, have gained such significant followings that they receive leaked government documents, bypassing established news organizations. This highlights the strong, personal connection these creators have with their audiences, which can rival or even surpass that of legacy media.

A critical concern is the potential collapse of the "primary layer" of journalism—the expensive, fact-gathering operations of organizations like CNN with global bureaus. While young people consume an enormous amount of news through platforms like TikTok, much of this content relies on clips and reports originating from traditional primary sources. If the business model for this foundational journalism crumbles, the source of original reporting for secondary commentary and public understanding could disappear.

Adding to this complexity, Meta announced a controversial policy to downgrade or "spike" creators who post "unoriginal content." This policy has caused alarm among creators who frequently share and comment on news footage, fearing it could severely impede the dissemination of news and public discourse. Critics argue this move is counterproductive, especially given how platforms like TikTok thrive on remixes and collaborations of existing content.

The situation is comparable to AI consuming primary sources without funding their creation. The discussion also raises questions about Section 230's relevance in an era of algorithmic amplification, as platforms like Meta actively boost certain content rather than merely hosting forums. The concern is that while large companies can withstand legal challenges, smaller creators and communities lack the resources to do so without Section 230 protections.

> What happens when the primary goes away? Because you, you're gonna, you know, these folks also basically like, they all need that That primary layer in order for their secondary commentary layer to work.

## 20:04 - 24:05 Exploring Personalized Algorithmic News Curation and Monetization

The discussion questions whether Section 230 protections should extend to algorithmic publishing, drawing a distinction from non-algorithmic, chronological feeds found on platforms like Mastodon or traditional forums. This debate points to a potential legal vulnerability for platforms that rely heavily on algorithmic content curation.

Individuals are increasingly creating or subscribing to highly personalized news tracking systems to manage information overload. Leo Laporte built a personal algorithm that delivers the ten most relevant articles daily based on his specific interests. Marshall Kirkpatrick uses "No Scroll Twitter," a Telegram bot that provides a curated list of stories aligned with his predefined interests for $10 a month.

These examples highlight a shift towards monetizing editorial judgment and bespoke curation, moving away from reliance on centralized behavioral profiles. Marshall's "Hawkeye" tool for organizations further exemplifies this, mapping and monitoring hundreds of related entities to provide tailored news insights, showcasing new business models for information delivery.

> Maybe Section two thirty doesn't and shouldn't defend the algorithmic publishing.

## 24:05 - 30:05 Algorithms Create Filter Bubbles and Limit Serendipitous Discovery

Modern information systems, including AI-driven news briefings and personalized social media feeds, are increasingly creating 'filter bubbles' that restrict users' exposure to diverse content. While efficient for finding tailored information, these systems often eliminate the chance encounter with unexpected or niche topics that was common with traditional media like physical newspapers.

The lack of serendipitous discovery is a significant problem. For instance, an AI-generated daily tech briefing might cover all major tech news but will miss the 'weird, the oddball' stories. This contrasts with experiences like subscribing to a publisher like PM Press, which sends a variety of books, some of which a person might never have chosen otherwise, exposing them to new ideas.

Platforms such as TikTok illustrate this shift. Initially known for its random, diverse content, TikTok's algorithm has become highly specific, constantly refining its feed to what it believes a user likes. This personalization, while effective, can quickly lead to content monotony, prompting users to try and 'reset' their feeds or even intentionally mislead the algorithm to broaden their exposure.

Escaping these algorithmic bubbles requires conscious effort from consumers. The challenge is to actively seek information outside of these curated feeds, recognizing that while personalization can be convenient, it risks narrowing one's worldview by consistently omitting information that falls outside a perceived interest profile.

> You don't find anything outside of my bubble. That's my number one problem. It's the filter bubble.

## 30:05 - 34:05 The Ethics of Targeted Advertising and AI Consolidation

Algorithms personalize content based on individual browsing history rather than the host website's content, often leading to unexpected or seemingly inappropriate ad placements. For example, a reverend found a provocative ad on a kid-safety site, not because of the site's content, but due to his own viewing history.

The instruments of power, such as corporations buying social networks and tuning algorithms, can reinforce specific cultural and political values. This self-reinforcing loop can align with appeals to purity and tradition, as discussed by Jonathan Haidt, rather than fostering diversity and growth.

The increasing prevalence of AI means a growing divide between those who can command computers and those who are directed by them. While AI offers potential for individual empowerment through custom filters and services, its rapid adoption is becoming a prerequisite for staying relevant in many tech fields.

However, there's a significant concern that the AI industry, much like other new technologies, is quickly consolidating power among a handful of dominant companies. This rapid consolidation means that despite individual empowerment, the control over this transformative technology is concentrated among very few entities.

> I'm sorry to tell you, Reverend, but the-- it's based not on what's on my website, it's based on what you're looking at, sir.

## 40:06 - 44:06 Google Transforms Search with AI, Raising Concerns for Content Creators

Google is undergoing a major transformation of its search platform using its Gemini 3.5 Flash model. Instead of providing lists of links, the new system offers direct answers, graphics, pictures, and video generation for longer queries. Google is also integrating online shopping directly into the search window, aiming to keep users within its ecosystem for purchases rather than sending them to external retail sites like Amazon.

This significant shift is Google's response to the rise of AI competitors such as Perplexity and ChatGPT, which are increasingly handling search queries and disintermediating traditional search engines. The goal is to retain users who now prefer AI-powered direct answers over clicking through multiple links.

However, this transformation raises substantial concerns about the future of content creators and publishers. By providing comprehensive answers directly within Google, the platform risks becoming a 'zero-click search' environment, significantly reducing traffic to external websites. This could severely impact the monetization models of sites that rely on search-driven visitors, potentially 'killing the goose that laid the golden eggs' for content generation.

Estimates suggest a dramatic impact, with companies like HubSpot potentially losing 70-80% of their search traffic and DMG Media documenting drops as steep as 89% for certain queries. While some users might initially appreciate the convenience, the long-term business implications for the broader information economy are a significant point of debate, with many viewing it as a short-sighted approach that destroys the market for information.

> We're entering the world of zero-click searches.

## 44:06 - 48:09 A study reveals large language models converge on homogenized answers, mirroring Google's narrowing information ecosystem.

A study called "Artificial Hive Mind" tested 70 top large language models with 27,000 open-ended creative questions. Researchers found that when questions were asked repeatedly, the answers from individual LLMs narrowed into a slimmer band of responses over time, becoming less expansive and more homogenized.

More critically, across all 70 different models, the answers began to converge on the same cliched responses, like "time is a river." This suggests a future where AI-generated information could become uniform, lacking diversity and originality.

This homogenization parallels concerns about Google's search experience. Once a source for diverse and specific results, Google now increasingly prioritizes its own services, such as YouTube videos or Google Shopping. This "self-dealing" behavior creates a "loop" where Google controls more of the information and purchasing journey.

The combination of converging AI answers and platform-controlled information sources creates a "narrowing spiral" of choice. This trend could lead to a future where algorithms make decisions for users, potentially eroding independent thought and diverse discovery in both information and commerce.

> And now, man, it's just gonna be margarine, you know?

## 48:09 - 56:09 The Dystopian Future of Seamless AI and Smart Glasses

Google is actively pursuing a future of "effortless" AI-driven commerce, where user requests for products, like a specific air freshener, are fulfilled automatically without further interaction. This strategy aims to keep users within Google's ecosystem, allowing the company to earn a transaction cut and shift search results from lists of links to direct, actionable answers.

This seamless automation raises concerns about its impact on critical thinking and education. If AI consistently provides immediate answers and handles decisions, it could undermine the traditional educational goal of teaching individuals how to acquire knowledge and think independently, potentially "dumbing down" the population.

The emergence of AI-powered smart glasses from Meta, Google, and Apple further illustrates this shift. Devices like Meta's Ray-Bans, which offer features like "Conversation Focus," and Apple's rumored camera-equipped AirPods, suggest a future where users increasingly experience the world through these tech giants' lenses, prompting significant privacy and surveillance worries reminiscent of dystopian sci-fi scenarios.

> You might think that the world is, is beautiful walking through San Francisco, but in the future, the vast majority of humanity will live in cement boxes in company towns, and they're gonna really want VR goggles.

## 56:09 - 1:00:11 The growing techlash against surveillance and AI reflects concerns over privacy and power dynamics.

A significant 'techlash' is emerging, evidenced by public resistance to technologies like automated license plate readers from Flock, despite their utility in fighting crime. While these systems can aid in abduction cases and apprehending criminals, people are increasingly concerned about privacy infringements and constitutional protections.

The widespread adoption of AI is also fueling this backlash. Recent anti-social media and anti-AI demonstrations at Berkeley highlight a desire for autonomy and agency from big tech companies. Students have even booed commencement speakers who enthusiastically promoted AI, indicating a significant disconnect in perspectives on the technology's future.

Drawing parallels to the Luddites, the resistance isn't necessarily against the technology itself, but against the power dynamics and business models it introduces. Just as Luddites opposed looms due to job displacement and unfavorable working conditions, current concerns about AI stem from its potential to displace early-career professionals or create metrics-driven environments like the "token Olympics" at Meta, despite offering productivity benefits to established users.

> The Luddites didn't hate looms, right? They hated the, the power dynamics and the business model, that, that led to looms putting them out of work.

## 1:00:11 - 1:04:12 Pope Francis's AI Encyclical Redefines Human Worth Beyond Productivity

Pope Francis's new encyclical on AI draws a parallel to historical warnings against industrial capitalism, which was seen as reducing human value to a calculation of productivity. The Catholic teaching, "imago Dei," posits that being human inherently holds value, regardless of output. The concern is that AI could similarly make human worth transactional.

The Pope, while not inherently anti-AI, is deeply concerned about its misuse, particularly in applications like warfare or any context that diminishes human dignity. His aim is to specifically name and address the traps society could fall into, a role he perceives governments are currently neglecting.

A key tension emerges as people, including the panel, actively use and benefit from AI in their daily lives, yet simultaneously express significant worries about its broader societal implications and impact on human worth. This highlights a disconnect between personal utility and ethical concerns.

> Being human is your value inherently.

## 1:04:12 - 1:08:12 Personalized AI Raises Privacy Concerns with Deep Data Integration

AI systems are becoming increasingly personal, capable of learning intimate details like pet names without direct input, which creates a sense of both convenience and unease. This level of personalization prompts questions about how AI acquires such specific information and the potential privacy implications of these highly tuned assistants.

Users are grappling with the trade-offs of feeding personal data to AI for enhanced assistance. While some actively provide sensitive information, such as health data and daily journals, to make their AI smarter and more tailored, others, like Larry Laporte, express discomfort with an entire life being stored in the cloud after experimenting with wearables.

The extent of AI's data collection and its proactive questioning capabilities are also a point of concern. Examples include Claude AI analyzing therapy notes and smart home devices like Alexa asking about personal plans when only simple information is requested, highlighting an intrusive curiosity that many find unsettling.

> It knows more about me than any doctor does.

## 1:12:13 - 1:20:14 AI in Medicine: Interpreting Scans and Spreading Hoaxes

Larry Magid recounted his positive experience using ChatGPT to interpret his CT scan. After feeding the scan and then the radiologist's report into the AI, he received a highly detailed, annotated map of his internal situation, which even his gastroenterologist found impressive and admitted exceeded his own ability to interpret the raw scan.

However, the discussion quickly turned to the risks of AI spreading misinformation. A researcher from the University of Gothenburg invented a fake disease called 'Bixonamania' with absurd details and published it on preprint servers. Despite clear indicators of a hoax, including a made-up university and satirical names, AI models picked up and spread information about this non-existent condition.

The panel emphasized the critical need for human vetting of AI-generated medical information. Larry explained his practice of always asking AI to cite sources and consulting a doctor before acting on any medical advice. The spread of Bixonamania highlighted how unreviewed sources, like preprint servers, can become entry points for misinformation that AI models readily absorb and disseminate.

While some advanced AI, like DeepSeek, are now aware of Bixonamania as a hoax, earlier versions and other models such as Microsoft Copilot and Gemini had confidently presented it as a real condition, underscoring the ongoing challenge of AI's susceptibility to hoaxes and the importance of not turning off human warning systems.

> Dr. ChatGPT did a heck of a good job explaining to me what was going on in my body.

## 1:20:14 - 1:28:15 Market pressures are pushing AI to replace human experts in healthcare, potentially compromising patient care.

Market forces are increasingly driving the adoption of AI in healthcare, not always for improved patient outcomes, but often to reduce costs by replacing human experts. This shift risks commoditizing healthcare, as seen in systems like Michigan's AI-based SNAP benefit determination or automated Medicare pre-approval processes where technology providers are incentivized to reject claims, removing crucial human support and oversight.

The ideal application of AI in medicine involves a collaborative partnership between human professionals and artificial intelligence. Rather than full replacement, AI serves as a powerful tool for experienced doctors to obtain second opinions, cross-reference information, and provide more comprehensive care. This model preserves the critical human judgment, skill, and empathy necessary for patient well-being.

Users benefit from consulting multiple AI models, as different platforms like ChatGPT and Gemini offer varied perspectives due to distinct post-training modifications by their parent companies. While AI can personalize advice by integrating a patient's medical history, the final validation from a human doctor remains essential to vet and contextualize the AI's output, ensuring accuracy and appropriate application.

> The problem is the market doesn't like that. What the market wants is to knock all the other things out and leave only the digital thing because it is the cheapest thing to use.

## 1:28:15 - 1:48:19 Navigating the Ethics of AI Use in Content Creation and Self-Disclosure

Many creators grapple with the ethical dilemma of claiming original work when AI tools significantly assist in content generation. There's a subtle dishonesty in phrases like "I made this" when AI played a substantial part, leading to a "dirty little secret" about AI use. This tension is heightened by conflicting workplace expectations, where some jobs penalize not using AI, while others punish its use.

A common example of this ethical blurring is AI-generated outreach emails. One guest recounted using an AI service that personalized emails to podcast hosts, claiming to have listened to specific episodes. While initially effective due to the human desire for praise, the guest later felt compelled to disclose the AI's role, recognizing the fundamental dishonesty of presenting AI-derived content as purely human effort.

The rise of AI also creates significant economic pressure for independent creators. To gain visibility in a saturated market, a high volume of content is often necessary. This forces a difficult choice: maintain a principled, manual approach and risk being overlooked, or leverage AI for increased output, potentially compromising authenticity.

Distinguishing between ethical and unethical AI use remains challenging. While employing AI for basic copy editing, grammar checks, or minor phrasing suggestions is generally accepted, using it to generate entire articles for payment feels dishonest. The insidious aspect is how quickly AI-generated ideas, such as "if it bleeds, it leads" for Substack growth, can be absorbed and mistaken for one's own, potentially compromising journalistic integrity.

> I, I, that kind of thing where it's like getting dressed up as if it's our work is a fundamentally dishonest proposition that I think is happening a lot right now.

## 1:48:19 - 1:52:19 Human Judgment and Perspective Become More Valuable as AI Devalues Facts

Historically, knowing facts was a valuable commodity, requiring resources like encyclopedias or trips to the library. People with good memories were also highly valued for their ability to recall information on demand.

The internet, particularly tools like Google, democratized access to facts, making them readily available to everyone. This shift reduced the premium on mere factual recall, transforming the value proposition for experts like Leo Laporte, whose skill evolved from knowing answers to quickly finding them.

In a world increasingly saturated with machine-produced information from AI, basic facts become commonplace. This development elevates uniquely human capabilities such as providing perspective, contextualizing information, and skillfully delivering insights, making them more critical.

The human ability to 'dance' with information—to adapt, synthesize, and present it compellingly, much like broadcasters like Walter Cronkite did during live events—becomes a defining and more valuable skill that AI can augment but not replace.

> Your value wasn't so much you knew the answer, but you knew how to put it in perspective, you could actually deliver it.

## 1:52:19 - 2:10:27 The OpenAI vs. Musk Trial Reveals Tech Billionaires' Egos and "Main Character" Syndrome

Jacob Ward attended the Elon Musk vs. Sam Altman trial as a member of the public, gaining firsthand insight into the high-stakes legal battle. He observed prominent tech figures like Satya Nadella and Greg Brockman testify, and the discovery phase offered a rare glimpse into their private communications and motivations.

A dominant theme was the extraordinary egos of Musk and Altman, who displayed a "main character of the universe" complex. Musk, for example, once suggested expanding a board based on "how much the fate of the world will rest on its shoulders." Altman's credibility was questioned under oath, where he admitted to having "lied in my time" and was revealed to have considered a run for governor.

The courtroom environment proved to be a leveler, stripping away VIP privileges; Musk was seen pacing hallways, and Altman waited in line for a urinal. Judge Yvette Gonzalez-Rodriguez maintained strict control, famously "slapping around" Musk and preventing any discussion of "AI doom" from derailing the proceedings.

Ultimately, the trial highlighted how unchecked power can foster a perception of self-importance, where billionaires view themselves as indispensable and others as mere "NPCs" or background actors. This mindset was evident in various decisions, from product design to their conduct under legal scrutiny.

> The casual way in which these guys clearly believe they are the main characters of the universe, and the rest of us are just kind of background actors, was the-- That was the theme for me of this trial.

## 2:10:27 - 2:16:29 Societal Trust, Inequality, and the Promise of Universal Basic Income

A growing sense of cynicism permeates society, leading people to believe that most things are scams. This erosion of trust is evident in instances like questionable claims for Tesla's Full Self-Driving or inexpensive "American values" phones. Such widespread distrust can have serious consequences, as exemplified by a person dismissing legitimate Social Security communications, delaying benefits for months. This societal erosion of trust, reminiscent of tactics used to destabilize social cohesion, threatens the ability to rely on shared systems.

Extreme wealth inequality further exacerbates this issue by atrophying empathy in those at the top. Research suggests that as individuals climb corporate hierarchies, their need for empathy diminishes because fewer people can challenge them. This can lead to powerful figures developing a low opinion of humanity, believing "these people suck." The lack of accountability for powerful individuals, such as a mere $1.25 million fine for Elon Musk manipulating Twitter stock value, reinforces this dynamic, making it feel like a negligible penalty.

To counter these trends, a Universal Basic Income (UBI) or a guaranteed minimum income is proposed. The argument is that freeing individuals from the necessity of working pointless jobs to pay rent could enable them to pursue truly impactful endeavors, potentially leading to breakthroughs akin to a new Einstein or Jonas Salk. Even one such individual's contributions could far outweigh the cost of the entire program, fostering innovation and breaking cycles of distrust and disengagement by allowing people to contribute their highest potential.

> There has been an erosion of American character to a point where we just expect everything's a scam and nobody really even thinks about it anymore.

## 2:16:29 - 2:20:30 Zohran Mamdani Pioneers Multi-Platform Streaming for Direct Constituent Engagement

New York City Mayor Zohran Mamdani has launched an innovative multi-platform streaming initiative called "Talk with the People," leveraging Twitch, TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, YouTube, X, Blue Sky, and podcasts. This pioneering effort is seen as a modern interpretation of the "fireside chat," allowing for direct, real-time engagement with his constituents.

The stream facilitates open dialogue through a live chat, fostering a direct line of communication between the mayor and the public. This approach proved highly successful, with the first episode attracting 35,000 Twitch subscribers. Such a model contrasts sharply with traditional political engagement, demonstrating a commitment to accountability that many established politicians avoid.

During his inaugural stream, Mamdani explained the financing behind his budget, detailing how it's funded in part by taxes on unoccupied multimillion-dollar apartments. He also highlighted his success in ensuring the state government honors its agreements regarding budget splits with the city, a historical challenge previous mayors faced.

> That's how all elected officials should be responsible to the people who elected them.

## 2:22:30 - 2:24:31 The Growing Challenges of Digital-Only Services

The increasing shift to exclusively digital services poses significant difficulties for individuals who are not proficient with technology, including many seniors. This digital dependency can lead to people being excluded from basic activities they once easily participated in.

Concrete examples illustrate this issue: a lifelong Yankee fan could no longer attend games because tickets were only available on smartphones. Similarly, a driver was unable to pay for parking at UC Davis because the app required a Wi-Fi signal, forcing them to find an alternative.

These scenarios highlight a growing digital divide where essential activities, from leisure to practical needs, become inaccessible for those without the necessary digital tools or skills. While some organizations, like the Dodgers, have made accommodations by providing a paper ticket to a long-time fan named Arrell Siegel, such solutions remain uncommon.

> I don't know how anybody who has any diminished capacity, and you know, God forbid, we could all be there someday, how they handle life today without the, the ability to thrive online.

## 2:30:32 - 2:34:32 Panelists Discuss Guilt Over Tech Promotion, Question Quantum Computing Investment, and Criticize GM's Data Sales

Several panelists express personal guilt regarding their roles in the tech industry. Leo Laporte and Larry Magid reflect on having encouraged constant tech consumption, such as buying new phones annually, and on being early advocates for the internet and various gadgets. Their reflections highlight a growing awareness of the broader societal and environmental impact of continuous technological upgrades and consumerism.

The US government has committed $2 billion to quantum computing research, with substantial allocations to companies like IBM ($1 billion) and Global Foundries ($375 million). The hosts question the rationale behind this investment, speculating that it might be primarily a national security initiative aimed at preventing adversaries like China from developing technologies that could break current encryption methods, rather than a clear profit-driven venture. Howard Lutnick, the Secretary of Commerce, claimed the investment would create thousands of high-paying jobs.

California has levied a $12.75 million fine against General Motors for selling sensitive data from its OnStar service to third-party data brokers. This data included detailed customer information such as driving habits, geolocation, names, and contact details, affecting hundreds of thousands of drivers between 2020 and 2024. This incident underscores a wider issue of corporations monetizing personal data without explicit consent, reminiscent of earlier disclosures about state health insurance marketplaces selling user information from ACA websites.

> I've been selling gadgets for twenty years. Encouraging people to buy a new phone every year, I feel, I have, I've definitely some, some guilt.

## 2:34:32 - 2:40:33 Police License Plate Tracking and Emerging Invisible Surveillance Technologies

A bipartisan amendment within the federal highway bill proposes to strip federal funding from cities and states that continue using automated license plate tracking programs, particularly Flock cameras. While these systems offer value in solving crimes like kidnappings or finding missing persons, they face scrutiny due to potential misuse, such as a law enforcement official using an ALPR to track an ex-girlfriend, highlighting the ongoing debate in communities like Petaluma.

The ethical complexities of surveillance extend to algorithmic bias, as seen in studies of speed cameras. Researchers found these cameras were more likely to tag black and brown individuals in cities like Detroit, not because they inherently drive faster, but because they often live in post-industrial areas with long, four-lane roads requiring longer commutes, where speed cameras are frequently placed. This contrasts with leafy suburban enclaves where road designs naturally limit speeding.

Beyond visible cameras, surveillance is becoming increasingly pervasive. Individuals are recorded in myriad ways, with biometric data like faces and gaits being captured. Chinese surveillance systems have been exported to major cities worldwide, including Rio, where they have reportedly reduced crime but also led to misuses, such as police monetizing footage on YouTube or instances of chiefs using ALPRs to harass people.

Cutting-edge, invisible surveillance technologies are also emerging. German scientists at the Karlsruhe Institute for Technology have demonstrated that ordinary Wi-Fi can identify people with perfect accuracy, even if they aren't carrying an active device, by observing radio wave propagation. Another system uses lasers to identify individuals by their unique heartbeat, with such technologies raising significant privacy concerns as they often do not require a warrant.

> Ordinary Wi-Fi can now identify people with perfect accuracy. Your, your, your Wi-Fi router? Yep. Can, can actually s- not only see that you're there, but can identify you, yep, even if you're not carrying an active device.

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